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Post by ellastangl on Aug 19, 2022 13:10:09 GMT -5
This past year I had a teacher who taught poorly and then complained to the class about how low our test scores were; he expected nothing less than perfection. Since he would never truly teach us during class, we practically had to teach ourselves from home. Learning the content on my own pushed me to exceed what I thought was possible, as I never had to work that hard in a class. I thought it was impossible to end with an A in his class, but after hours of studying, I came out with one. In our education system, motivation to have a high GPA is built in through the grading system. Throughout school, the importance of grades and test scores are constantly stressed, giving us the idea that they are the sole factor in determining your future. Although they are important to colleges, they don’t define your success and are one of many factors considered for colleges. Traditional motivation has worked very well for me, but I think that’s due to my competitive nature and the need to achieve my personal goals. I believe the first half of our education system should include everyone receiving general education until their early teenage years, allowing them to be well-rounded in all subjects. Following this, they can pick subject areas that interest them more and drop the classes they hate. I think this would draw kids more towards school since they aren't forced to learn about topics that don't interest them.
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Post by madelynide on Aug 19, 2022 20:10:17 GMT -5
During my time in high school, I have taken two AP classes; AP United States History and AP Psychology. Both of these classes my older sister took before me and performed well on the AP exams, earning a 4 and 5 respectively. Because she had done so well on these exams I felt as if she had set the mark for me and I had to reach it. Even though doing well on the exams isn’t the most important thing and AP classes are more about the skills you get out of them, I was still extraordinarily proud of myself when I earned 5’s on both of the exams. I felt as if I had reached the mark that my older sister had set for me. In general terms, I have always pushed myself to receive all A’s and be a “perfect student” no matter the class or the class difficulty. And I’ve found that whenever I thought I couldn’t do it, the material was too difficult and that I would never understand, I could. When I thought there was too much going on in my personal life and I wouldn’t be able to focus and get my work done, I did. The specific courses that really taught me that I can do anything no matter the circumstances were my two AP classes and the Health Science CTE course that I took my junior year. All of those were very rigorous and required a lot of out of class work. However, all of those courses I sought out myself. I had to apply for Health Science and specifically sign up for the APs. Those opportunities aren’t built into the school system, you have to find them yourself. I believe that if those opportunities were more easily afforded to all students, more students would push themselves and find that they can take harder courses and do well in them. Traditional motivation for students is grades. If students receive higher grades it is easier for them to pursue their dreams and not get bogged down in lower levels of education. For me, this motivation has always worked. While I don’t want to go to a prestigious university, I wanted to receive good enough grades that I could go wherever I wanted to. I didn’t want to have to stress about getting into whatever college I decided to go to. In addition to this, my older sister also has a few learning disabilities and my parents were always worried about her in school. While this isn’t a traditional motivator, I put a lot of pressure on myself to receive good grades, always do my work and overall just be someone my parents didn’t have to worry about school-wise. I believe that an educational system that understands all students are different, both academically and in their personal lives, and work to meet students where they are at while pushing them would be much more motivating than students having to seek out themselves the classes that would push them to grow. I also believe that if society as a whole didn’t focus so much on a number (test scores, GPA, etc.) defining your worth, students would feel more motivated because they wouldn’t feel as pressured. They would know that their best was always enough.
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Post by madelynide on Aug 19, 2022 20:27:31 GMT -5
"Accommodation and support from every person within the educational system are motivating for the student, grades just are one way to express that success and are not even a full measure of it."
This point brought up by nateyat is an extremely important one. So often students, including myself, feel as if their worth is defined by a letter on a piece of paper, a SAT score, an AP score, etc. In a way, society treats it as if it. Universities, especially highly competitive ones, often look at scores as a way of defining students and don’t look at the individual as a whole. They don’t think about factors that may have led students to receive lower grades or scores than they may have normally received. For example, my one and only A- in high school happened in the first trimester of my sophomore year. My sophomore year was the 2020-2021 school year and I was adjusting to being in online school, along with drastically reduced class time. In addition to just trying to adjust to an entirely different type of school than what I was used to, I started dealing with pain all the time. This was incredibly isolating and terrifying as I was only 15 at the time – the majority of 15 year-olds don’t deal with chronic pain. Colleges may just look at this one A- and think that I just didn’t try hard enough in the class when in reality there were so many other factors that played into me receiving that A-. The A- doesn’t tell the whole story of what was happening during those three months. That isn’t something colleges can tell by simply looking at my transcript. And I know the full story and know that to even have received only one A- was incredible due to everything that was occurring.
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Post by ameliagougam on Aug 19, 2022 21:28:54 GMT -5
This quote is very true depending on the circumstances. I have attended many schools in my life including an international IB school. When I was attending the IB school, there was plenty of focus on standardized testing and pressure from teachers to be the best. However, I often found that it was much harder to excel in classes because every student was trying harder. I’m a somewhat competitive person, especially when it comes to school, and I always wanted to impress my teachers. I would push myself to float beyond the mark of the teachers; but I wasn’t the only person doing that, which made it more difficult. When I came to Loy Norrix, however, my effort changed drastically. I noticed that teachers' standards were lower and students' work ethics were also lower. Thus, it was much easier for me to achieve good grades or be one of the “best in class”. This meant I could simply float to the mark my teacher's set and I would be fine. Which was true, but it didn’t bring me the satisfaction that I thought it would. I realized that although I had good grades, I didn’t feel like I earned them because I didn’t push myself to do my best, or work as hard as I could– I simply did what was asked of me. People do not strive to achieve knowledge anymore, and I think that is one of the main issues in school systems. Academia is a privilege and it should be looked at as such, not as a requirement. I think that a school system in which students came to learn and teachers came to teach would be the best thing for our society. No one is focused on their grades or being better than others, they simply come to learn and increase their knowledge and enjoy the beauty in being knowledgeable.
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Post by ameliagougam on Aug 19, 2022 21:32:47 GMT -5
Last year I took geometry as my math class, and while I struggled to learn the subject, I did learn quite a bit about how our school system works. The teacher was committed to making sure as many students as possible passed their class, but that was about it. We were allowed to reference our notes for tests and quizzes, and if it wasn't for that simple policy, I would have had far worse scores. The teacher tried their best but struggled to instill even the simplest concepts in me and the rest of the class. I was able to "float to the mark" that was set for me and got good final grades, but that was simply due to the motivation of having a good grade left on my high school transcript. Grades have always been the thing keeping me motivated, however, they often leave me floating up the mark expected of me and staying there. But when in regards to things I'm more interested and engaged in, I tend to float above the mark due to interest and the desire to prove myself. I agree with this. I also know of some teachers who understand the pressure that students face when it comes to getting a passing grade in a class, or better yet, be an “A Student” all year. Though it is very comforting to have a teacher who understands this struggle and is willing to help, the help has to be done correctly or it won’t be useful at all. I knew a teacher who did the same things as mentioned here. They would allow students to use notes on exams– but those notes were just words that students had copied directly off the board from the teacher. In the end, I passed the class with an A, but I learned nothing. Because I didn’t push myself to study, I just pushed myself to finish the miniscule amount of work the teacher assigned us. In most cases, floating to the mark isn’t enough for me, because I don’t feel satisfied with my work.
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sam
New Member
Posts: 10
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Post by sam on Aug 20, 2022 19:18:34 GMT -5
I believe that unless a student is intrinsically motivated to exceed expectations they will rise to what is expected of them but no farther. I have personally experienced this throughout all of my years of schooling I have gotten through school getting good grades and have been successful but none of that was done because I wanted to do I was simply trying to do what was expected of me. Not only would I never try to achieve anything higher than what was expected of me but I would try to find the easiest way to achieve that goal because I saw no point in putting in the extra work when I would be rewarded the same as someone who did try harder. I believe the only time students are truly motivated is when they are interested in a subject and see a different reward based on how hard they work, for example in all my years of schooling I have never had a class or been taught a subject that I am interested in but I found out that I am very interested in finances and the stock market and with this interest I spend hours every day researching and working towards becoming more well versed in the subject compared to at school I try to do the smallest amount of work to receive the grade I want. So overall I believe that the only way to motivate a student is to either show them the value in learning something or have them be passionate about it.
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Question 4
Aug 21, 2022 19:58:01 GMT -5
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Post by adewees on Aug 21, 2022 19:58:01 GMT -5
This statement is 100% true. Throughout all of my school life I have noticed this of me and other students. There are few students that push themselves to do their best just because they desire it, and plenty who don’t even float to the mark. However, the rest of us just do what is necessary to pass. I can correlate this statement with most of my school life, up until 8th grade. In 8th grade my father raised the incentive by giving me $100 when I would get all A’s in a trimester. Traditional motivation did not push me to do better than what was required, but this extra incentive did. I have gotten all A’s almost every trimester since this “deal”. I have not been pushed to exceed what I originally thought possible, however I have been pushed further than what I thought likely. I don’t think there is an educational system that could motivate all students, there will always be students that will not push themselves further than need be, and sometimes not at all. What really helped me maintain good grades was good parenting, and a proper punishment and reward system.
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Post by dominickf on Aug 22, 2022 13:37:26 GMT -5
This statement is extremely true especially for students who don't know what they want to do or for younger students who don't exactly understand. Especially throughout elementary school, it was just learning what the teachers wanted you to learn and making the progress you are meant to make and if you don't you aren't "trying hard enough." I think there are some teachers in my experience who are there just to get you to learn what you have to learn and on the other hand there are some teachers who will push students to go further especially if it is something interesting to them. I myself feel like there are some classes I just try to get by in because I don't find them interesting or I just want to get what I have to get done to pass while in some classes I'm extremely motivated and want to learn even more which pushes me further. I think the only set motivation is credits which don't even start to begin until 8th grade and some kids still don't understand what credits mean in 8th grade so for some people it takes til high school to understand. I don't think there will ever be a system that will motivate everyone because not everyone learns the same. The education system is so strict on learning certain things if you want to learn them or not. Some kids can have a great education mentally then they get to one thing they aren't good at or don't like and it completely ruins all motivation for them period and they start to slip in other areas too. I think nothing will ever work until everyone is able to realize that kids all need and want different things out of their education.
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Post by babydollbouncyballs on Aug 24, 2022 11:32:35 GMT -5
“Students will float to the mark you set.” I think this statement truly depends on the teacher and their expectations as well as the student and their motivations. If you set too high of a bar to achieve the students who sink too far below it will be discouraged to even attempt to meet it again and give up. However, if you set it too low then the students who rise too far above it are discouraged and bored with the coursework. I also think this statement has a lot to do with people's general interest in the subject and the way the information is presented. People are naturally more motivated to do things that they like and with things like schoolwork it can be difficult to get students to engage in coursework they dislike. I also think that even if you are pushed to success and that bars standards, the likelihood of upholding them after meeting them depends almost entirely on your personal interest in that subject and in achieving the bars standards. I personally struggled last year in a class I took in a subject that I had never experienced before with a teacher who did not exactly teach. Although I did well in the class overall when I moved to a higher level class in that subject my foundation was missing entirely. I was discouraged because around me my peers who didn't have that teacher were doing excellent and I couldn't understand the most basic concepts. In the end I studied hard for the class because I was interested in the subject and liked my new teacher. However, for some people I know that can be easier said than done. I know some of my friends, and even my brother have reached a bar set for them but were generally disinterested in the subject and therefore, after reaching the expectation put less work in and made them fall below the bar. You can motivate someone to reach a standard however you want but in the end upholding that standard really just depends on how much they enjoy the subject and how much they're willing to put into it compared to other things.
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Post by brendant on Aug 24, 2022 14:17:23 GMT -5
Through out my life I have seen this in places other than the class room; sports, jobs, social activities. personally in school this has always been in my writing aspects, I hate to write, one of my least favorite things to do along side reading. Time and time again I was told by my teachers and parents that I have a natural knack for this thing I detest. Me being told this I didn't try any harder than I needed to in the past, but this last year of school I saw my self try and put that hidden talent to use. It was nothing given or shown to my by our classes that helped my try and use this artistry, but more my own waking experiences that showed me how beautiful writing can be if done by the right artist. "Getting a good grade" or "reward" was never something exciting for me when I tried my hardest, cause these works would be looked at by one person and then forgotten and that was a shame to everyone's writing abilities, putting kids works on display or something that was mandatory to read by the class or school would more than motivate kids to try harder when composing a story about ones life or even a short and simple story, schools would become flares for advancement and joy. But I am a kid and who is to say that hope would come true, until then the line you set is where the majority will lie.
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Question 4
Aug 25, 2022 18:28:46 GMT -5
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Post by sthompson on Aug 25, 2022 18:28:46 GMT -5
I used to believe the quote “Students will float to the mark you set” was true, now I think it totally depends on the student. I think it puts a lot of pressure on teachers as if they can control how students react to new information or how they process it, when in reality, everyone is capable of different things and every individual has their own limits that they can’t control. Which means the quote is not only setting up an un-achievable expectation for teachers but also the students. I personally have always had good grades, and up until highschool it was extremely easy to do so. However I, started to have panic attacks, as well as other things to complicate school work due to focusing. So when I went from believing that quote, to joining Apush and having panic attacks where I shook so much I couldn’t physically write a DBQ, I felt like I wasn’t trying enough or I wasn’t a smart as everyone else in that class. I literally got a great grade too, so I had no reason to stress out, which is I guess how anxiety works, but anybody who witnessed it can vouch for me when I say the pressure of that class along with other class workloads, and sports sucked me in. I literally wouldn’t sleep, I would study like 24/7 and I couldn’t get my mind off of the idea that I might fail to meet mine or my schools expectations. I never once thought that maybe I should take a step back and re evaluate my expectations for myself, I just saw that other students in my class were thriving with the same teaching as I. Which is where that quote can become unhealthy, as teachers might feel like they’re doing a disservice to students if they aren’t thriving, and students might as if they aren’t trying enough if others are seemingly doing a little better than them. Everyone needs to understand themselves as an individual, their strengths and their weaknesses. Holding yourself up to someone else’s expectations will either spread you too thin, or let you pass by without even trying, both of which are doing a disservice to yourself.
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Question 4
Aug 25, 2022 18:47:15 GMT -5
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Post by sthompson on Aug 25, 2022 18:47:15 GMT -5
I believe that unless a student is intrinsically motivated to exceed expectations they will rise to what is expected of them but no farther. I have personally experienced this throughout all of my years of schooling I have gotten through school getting good grades and have been successful but none of that was done because I wanted to do I was simply trying to do what was expected of me. Not only would I never try to achieve anything higher than what was expected of me but I would try to find the easiest way to achieve that goal because I saw no point in putting in the extra work when I would be rewarded the same as someone who did try harder. I agree, I think is good to have the basic expectation of effort, but when we’re trained to just meet the mark our teacher sets, we’re being set up for failure. No teacher has the same expectations and no school has the same expectations. I think we should be taught, and we should teach other young students to follow their own lead and make their own goals besides of course the basics like participation. I was the same way when I was younger, I didn’t try because I saw that the kids who acted out would get the same grades as me and would get rewarded for the behavior that I had been modeling the whole year just as everyone else was expected. Of course when you look back now, it’s obvious that some kids might need more assistance and encouragement, equity is important and I agree with that, however that just proves that teachers cannot set the same bar for every student. It’s impossible, everyone has different backgrounds, home lives, self confidence and just in general everyone is different . No teacher can set one bar for every student and have it be fair, it will always be harder for some than others. Also sorry if I’m quoting this incorrectly the websites glitching on my computer and my phone is changing the set up.
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Post by rubyberg on Aug 27, 2022 12:33:59 GMT -5
I really struggled freshman year during online school. In middle school, I had never really created a good worth ethic because school just seemed to come easy to me. However, when we went online, everything felt optional. I could never seem to get out of my bed in the morning to join a class at the table. Instead, I often would skip classes and rarely do my work. I still managed to scrape by passing all my classes, but when the school year was over, and my mental health was starting to strengthen, I began to reflect. I was so disappointed with myself, because I knew that if I had just tried a little bit harder I could've been happy with the outcome. If I was pushed to do better that year, I had just chosen to ignore it because everything just felt too hard. However, once school was in person it didn't feel optional anymore. I did tremendously better sophomore year just because it was in person. However, there were still many times where my lack of work ethic got the best of me and I had to try a bit harder. But honestly, I don't really agree with "students will float to the mark you set." This is because mental health exists. Some students, could be pushed everyday to try their hardest and it could still not work. However, I do believe that negatively impacting a student will cause more harm than there is already.
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Post by Kierra Walker on Aug 27, 2022 13:00:11 GMT -5
I think that it depends on the student and how well they feel they can handle a class. If a student excels in the subject, then most of the time they will easily go past any goals set for them because it gives them something to work for without feeling stressed out by the workload. If a student is barely getting by in a class even with full effort, then they will probably only work to the goal set for them and nothing more because just getting there is already enough of an accomplishment. For me, I generally do try to hit the marks set by my teachers because I don't typically struggle with school work itself but the management of everything can be quite stressful and it's easy to get burnt out which is another thing that needs to be factored in. Even if I can do the work, I may not go past what's expected because it's sometimes just not worth the added stress. The school system is too in-general. Every student is different and needs their own motivation. Students need plans tailored for them if they really want to be successful.
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Post by abosak on Aug 28, 2022 13:56:06 GMT -5
The statement "Students will float to the mark you set" has applied to me on many occasions, but there have been times where it hasn’t. Throughout my educational experience, I’ve never had to learn how to study, or had to really apply myself in classes. I’ve always floated through school with no real struggle until last year, when I was put into AP calc and AP chem. What I did in those two classes were polar opposites of each other. I floated through AP calc and had the most fun I’ve ever had at school because the teacher was amazing and set a high bar. AP chem, on the other hand, was a struggle because I didn’t enjoy the subject, and the bar was extremely high. My motivation was very low and I was unable to float to the mark that my teacher had set. Traditional motivation isn’t good enough most of the time for me. I’ll try to get an A, but if my grade dips low enough, I’ll start to think it’s hopeless to try and go for a good grade and become unmotivated to participate in class. My educational experiences have pushed me to where I think I should be, but I know that I can do much better. The motivations built into the school system, like grades and such, work good in principle, but eventually, kids are tired of checking grades constantly and being stressed over a letter on a computer screen. Kids need genuine motivators to function in school. The educational system that might motivate all students would be an educational system that is fun to learn in and the classes I have learned the most are the classes that are the most fun. If schools are able to make learning fun, then students would be able to float through any bar you give them.
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