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Post by Ms. English on May 30, 2023 7:39:27 GMT -5
Post your answers to the discussion question here. Make sure to read the responses of those posted before you and respond directly to them when appropriate before posting your own.
Connections: Compare Anzaldúa's sense of herself as an American to Audre Lorde's in "The Fourth of July" (p. 221). In what way does each woman feel American? In what way does each not?
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Post by Marley Mickel on Jun 29, 2023 22:25:58 GMT -5
In both, “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldúa and “The Fourth of July” by Audre Lorde, they tell stories from their life about how they feel American because of their citizenship, and how they both do not feel American. In “The Fourth of July” by Audre Lorde, Audre writes about a time in her life when she went on a family trip to Washington D.C. for a graduation present. Audre’s family’s use of transportation was a railroad train, the family went at night on the milk train because it was cheaper. Audre expressed her feelings of wanting to eat in the dining car because she had read about them, her mother used the excuse of it costing too much money and germs, but the real reason was that African Americans were not allowed into the railroad dining cars headed to the South in 1947 even though they are American citizens, they are faced with racism. In “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldúa, Anzaldúa writes about a time when she was young, she was sent to the corner of the classroom for talking back but what Anzaldúa was really doing was telling the teacher how to correctly pronounce her name. In response, she was told. “If you want to be American, speak ‘American.’ If you don’t like it, go back to Mexico where you belong.” Again, she is in fact an American citizen however she is not treated like one.
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Post by hannahboothby on Jul 7, 2023 17:38:59 GMT -5
In both, “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldúa and “The Fourth of July” by Audre Lorde, they tell stories from their life about how they feel American because of their citizenship, and how they both do not feel American. In “The Fourth of July” by Audre Lorde, Audre writes about a time in her life when she went on a family trip to Washington D.C. for a graduation present. Audre’s family’s use of transportation was a railroad train, the family went at night on the milk train because it was cheaper. Audre expressed her feelings of wanting to eat in the dining car because she had read about them, her mother used the excuse of it costing too much money and germs, but the real reason was that African Americans were not allowed into the railroad dining cars headed to the South in 1947 even though they are American citizens, they are faced with racism. In “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldúa, Anzaldúa writes about a time when she was young, she was sent to the corner of the classroom for talking back but what Anzaldúa was really doing was telling the teacher how to correctly pronounce her name. In response, she was told. “If you want to be American, speak ‘American.’ If you don’t like it, go back to Mexico where you belong.” Again, she is in fact an American citizen however she is not treated like one. I agree, both of them show the way that some Americans are treated as second-class citizens through the lenses of children. It’s more explicit in “The Fourth of July,” as the essay is about Lorde’s loss of innocence as a child experiencing racism. Anzaldua also describes how being punished for speaking Spanish at school damaged her sense of identity. Both of these stories show how racism affects even young kids and that it’s not a problem limited to adults. The difference between the way the authors write about these situations is that Anzaldua writes from an adult perspective as well, while Lorde only describes her childhood. “The Fourth of July” ends on an unhappy note with Lorde realizing the reality of American Racism. “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” ends on a hopeful note. While Anzaldua spends her essay acknowledging the racism she faces and the ways she struggles with her identity, she also talks about the pride she has in her heritage and the hope she has for Chicanos in the future.
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Post by audratate on Jul 19, 2023 18:34:19 GMT -5
In both, ¨How to Tame a Wild Tongue¨ by Gloria Anzaldua and ¨The Fourth of July¨ by Audre Lorde, they use stories from their childhood to show how they both feel American well at the same time feeling like they do not belong in America. They both describe the feeling of being American because they both have citizenship, which by law states that they are a citizen of America. But then both authors continue to write about their life stories as a child and how the feeling of being an American was not present. In Anzalduas essay she writes about her school and how she was punished for trying to fix the teachers pronunciation of her name, she then got in trouble for ¨talking back¨ and she said her sense of identity was lost. In Lordes essay, she wrote about not feeling american because of the way she looked, she was discriminated against because of her skin.
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sofia
New Member
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Post by sofia on Jul 26, 2023 14:01:38 GMT -5
In “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldua, her American identity comes from her experience of not being completely accepted by Latinos or Americans, falling into a different category of “Chicanos”. As someone from Latin descent being born in America, she is able to have the legal rights that are given to everyone, no matter their descent. Even though she has the abilities of an American, it is alienating at the same time. The connection between her heritage and country are separated within her. There is always pressure to either be “more Spanish” or “more American” which comes in many forms, including her language. For example, Anzaldua details how as a young child she was forced to speak English without an accent in America but to native Spanish speakers she is “butchering” the language when she doesn’t speak in English. In “The Fourth of July” by Audre Lorde, she feels as American as any other person, as America is the only home she has ever known. However, because of her non-white ethnicity, it causes conflict in her everyday life. Using stories from her life, she shows the unjust discrimination faced by anyone who isn’t deemed “American”. There will always be a separation between the rights of white Americans and everyone else, even though this country was founded on the belief that everyone in the eyes of the law are equal.
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Post by Eloise on Jul 28, 2023 11:24:03 GMT -5
In both Anzaldua’s “How to Tame a Wild Tongue,” and Lorde’s “The Fourth of July,” they talk about their experiences as children and not feeling like they check all the boxes. In Anzaldua's situation, she feels alienated by both Americans and Latinos. She is American by birth but Latina by heritage. If she acts too Latina in front of people, she gets called out and punished but if she acts too American, she is accused of opposing her culture. On the other hand, Lorde has always felt American as it is the country she was born and she has been shielded from racism, in but in her story, she faces first-hand discrimination for the first time and begins to question herself. Both women feel American, as they are American by law and they have lived in that country their whole lives, but both also have conflicting feelings about it and feel that more often than not, they are treated as foreigners because of something they have no control over.
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Post by georgia on Jul 28, 2023 18:10:25 GMT -5
In both Anzaldua’s “How to Tame a Wild Tongue,” and Lorde’s “The Fourth of July,” they talk about their experiences as children and not feeling like they check all the boxes. In Anzaldua's situation, she feels alienated by both Americans and Latinos. She is American by birth but Latina by heritage. If she acts too Latina in front of people, she gets called out and punished but if she acts too American, she is accused of opposing her culture. On the other hand, Lorde has always felt American as it is the country she was born and she has been shielded from racism, in but in her story, she faces first-hand discrimination for the first time and begins to question herself. Both women feel American, as they are American by law and they have lived in that country their whole lives, but both also have conflicting feelings about it and feel that more often than not, they are treated as foreigners because of something they have no control over. I agree that both Anzaldua and Lorde feel like they are not fully American because of discrimination they experienced when they were children. In both “The Fourth of July” and “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” the women discuss how racist opinions and actions negatively impacted their perceptions on their identities and made them feel less American. For example, in “The Fourth of July”, Lorde writes about being told she and her family can’t eat at an ice cream parlor solely because of their race and in “How to Tame a Wild Tongue”, Anzaldua discusses how she was punished for speaking Spanish at school and told to “go back to Mexico” by a teacher, despite the fact that she was born and raised in the US. I also agree with you about how Anzaldua further questions her American identity due to her Latina heritage and culture, whereas Lorde grows up feeling more American until she realized the full extent of racism on her trip to DC.
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Post by Alanna Brockman on Jul 30, 2023 14:11:56 GMT -5
In the essays "How to Tame a Wild Tongue' and "The Fourth of July", both authors talk about the oppression they face by living in America. This oppression makes them feel less American because they don't fit into the standards of an "ideal American". In "How to Tame a Wild Tongue" Anzaldua writes about how she feels by speaking English she is opposing her culture, and when speaking Spanish or other dialects, she is punished. Her language or her "tongue" gives her a sense of identity, but is discriminated against because of how she speaks. In "The Fourth of July" Lorde writes about how she was discriminated against because of how she looks. Even though being born in America and identifying as American, Lorde is still discriminated against, making her feel less "American" in a way. In both essays, the authors are American by birth, but wrongfully treated, making them feel conflicted on their sense of identity.
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Post by margaretscavarda on Aug 7, 2023 13:44:18 GMT -5
Both Gloria Anzaldúa and Audre Lorde experience hate because of their culture and identities. When Anzaldúa is speaking with Spanish-speaking non-Americans, she feels very American and judged in that way. She feels outcasted and like she doesn't belong. She doesn't feel "Spanish" enough. On the contrary, when she is with Americans (especially at school and those who don't speak Spanish), she is shamed for her Chicana roots. She is shamed for speaking with an accent. She would get punished if she tried to correct her teacher's pronunciation of her name. There are times when she feels too American and times when she feels not American enough. Audre Lorde experiences a similar form of discrimination. Lorde was born in America and speaks English as her first language, yet, she is treated poorly because of the color of her skin. Even though both Lorde and Annzaldúa are American citizens, they aren't treated like it.
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Question 3
Aug 14, 2023 14:30:03 GMT -5
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Post by cristianvargas on Aug 14, 2023 14:30:03 GMT -5
Both Gloria Anzaldúa in “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” and Audre Lorde in “The Fourth of July” explore their sense of themselves as Americans and the complexities that come with that identity. However, their perspectives and experiences differ in significant ways. Anzaldúa’s sense of herself as an American is deeply rooted in her Chicana identity and the various languages and cultural influences she embodies. She embraces her cultural heritage and sees herself as a product of both Mexican and American experiences. However, Anzaldúa also grapples with the challenges of being marginalized within American society due to her language and cultural differences. She reflects on the pressures to conform to the dominant English language and the impact that has on her sense of self and her cultural identity. On the other hand, Lorde’s perception of herself as an American in “The Fourth of July” is marked by a sense of disillusionment and alienation. She recounts her experience of racial discrimination during a family trip to Washington, D.C. on Independence Day. Lorde feels the weight of being a Black person in America, facing racism and the constant reminders of inequality and injustice. Her experience leads her to question the notion of celebrating a country that does not fully include or value people like her. both Anzaldúa and Lorde grapple with their sense of American identity, but from distinct perspectives. Anzaldúa embraces her Chicana heritage and language diversity as part of her American identity, while Lorde questions and critiques America’s treatment of marginalized communities, creating a complex relationship with her American identity.
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Post by addisen on Aug 15, 2023 16:39:04 GMT -5
In both Anzaldua’s “How to Tame a Wild Tongue,” and Lorde’s “The Fourth of July,” they talk about their childhood experiences and how they feel they don't belong in America. She knew that she had the legal rights to be an American but because of her past experiences of being in trouble because of "talking back" and ect. She did not feel welcomed into America so therfore she didn't feel she belonged.
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Post by violetkn on Aug 16, 2023 9:59:23 GMT -5
In both Anzaldúa's “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” and Lorde’s “The Fourth of July” the writers discuss how they do not have a good sense of self and feel ashamed of their cultural ties. However, Anzaldúa discusses how she has felt this way since she was a young child and Lorde did not realize this until her trip to Washington D.C.. Lorde also still holds a sense of empowerment after her experience, while Anzaldúa seems to gain this later in life. Another difference is that Lorde’s family attempted to shield her from the discrimination she would face with her not knowing the true reason why they were going to Washington D.C. as a family trip as well as why they did not eat in the dining car. However, Anzaldúa was told of the discrimination she would face and even faced it from a young age, discussing how her mother would tell her that she must learn how to speak without an accent.
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Post by Anna Miedema on Aug 17, 2023 11:08:33 GMT -5
Anzaldua feels American in the sense that she is accepted in the United States and is not facing racial segregation everywhere she goes, like Lorde. However, being Latina in the US isn’t easy either. Having to code switch and getting punished for speaking Spanish is no walk in the park. I would argue that Anzaldua feels less American than Lorde because she has such deep, complex Spanish roots. Lorde and her family know that they are American, even when the United States continuously tries to tell her that they aren’t. Lorde and Anzaldua can relate to many things such as feeling out of place and like they don’t belong. Lorde may have had to fear for her life more often considering her experiences in Jim Crow America. Anzaldua may get discriminated against for speaking her native tongue (or one of many). Nevertheless, both women are at severe disadvantages and will have to jump through many more hoops than white American men.
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Post by Hailey Lowry on Aug 18, 2023 10:27:55 GMT -5
In both, “How to Tame a Wild Tongue” by Gloria Anzaldua and “The Fourth Of July” by Audre Lorde, they tell stories from when they were growing up to show how they feel American while at the same time not feeling like they belong. In both stories, They feel American because they were born in America, and that makes them legal citizens. Anzaldua doesn't feel like she belongs in either her Latina heritage or as an American. She is constantly being judged by someone for either speaking in Spanish or in English and she feels like she doesn't belong. Lorde doesn't feel like she belongs because she is constantly being discriminated against because of her color of skin. They both face different types of discrimination throughout their life and it affects how they feel about their American identity.
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Post by Zoe Reeves on Aug 20, 2023 16:50:05 GMT -5
In both stories, Lorde and Anzaldua share their experiences of growing up in America faced with injustices, along with interconnectedness of self identity, expression, and culture. Both are American women by citizenship and where they live, however, they don’t feel accepted. In “How to Tame a Wild Tongue”, Anzaldua writes how she doesn’t feel accepted by Americans, Mexicans, nor native Spanish speakers. She recalled stories where Americans made snarky comments about how she spoke English with an accent, or how teachers wouldn’t make an effort to pronounce her name correctly, leaving her to feel that Americans wanted to strip her of her individuality and cultural roots to fit the social norms in America. Yet, didn’t feel accepted to native Spanish speakers due to the way she spoke Spanish, and wasn’t considered “Chicana enough”. Similarly, in “The Fourth of July”, Lorde also felt a sense of lost self identity, as she wasn’t accepted by Americans because of racism she was faced with in America in the 1950s. Her tone shifted in her writing from excitement about the first time visiting Washington D.C., to frustration due to racial injustices her and her family faced throughout this vacation, but also resentment towards her parents from sheltering her and neglecting to teach her about racism. Both struggle with finding where to fit in, however, neither can be cateogorized into groups American society creates. Even though both Anzaldua and Lorde are American citizens, they are treated poorly and are discriminated against by peers.
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